Cravens Home Inspection Service PO Box 925 Bixby, Oklahoma 74008 (918)369-6947 Jeremy & Ginger Victory Victory Stoneworks 4740 South Mingo Tulsa, Oklahoma I contracted with Victory Stoneworks to install granite counter tops in my kitchen and two bathrooms and paid them a down payment of $3661.00 on 5/27/14. This has been a very trying experience. I paid my bill in full on 6-27-14 ($1830.72) even though they were not finished (Big Mistake!). Small Bathroom: Poorly mitered pencil trim - sloppy Cracked tile installed Tile installed with corner missing. Caulk around counter top to tile backsplash cracked. New Delta faucets were left on driveway - skirt damaged / Lift rod bent Plumber did not show up as scheduled. Plumber did not have any supplies Flex water lines thrown away. Water lines thrown away. Plumber did not have any transportation so I had to loan plumber truck so he could go to Lowe's to buy parts needed. Plumber installed drain lines crooked because he cut one pipe too short. After plumber left I noticed one water line had a small leak. Backsplash not sealed to counter top Plumber did not leave until 10 pm
Hall Bathroom Counter top overhang too short. Poorly mitered pencil trim North granite skirt too short - gap at wall Wood used to build base splinters. Faucets installed too close to backsplash Unable to close the drain control using the lift rod as designed. Flex water lines thrown away
The counter top only hangs over about 3/16 of an inch at one end in the hall bathroom fixed? Kitchen Sink Counter - West End Newly painted wall damaged Large gap under pencil trim on west end of counter top. Plumbing pipes thrown away Backsplash not sealed to counter top Damaged the sound proofing on my expensive sink which voided the warranty
Kitchen Sink Counter East End Pencil trim on east end broken off leaving large gap between counter top and bottom of trim. Backsplash not sealed to counter top. Corner tiles pushed in when counter top was installed One tile knocked loose when counter top installed.
Kitchen Cook Top Counter Backsplash to counter top mortar cracked or missing. Poorly mitered corners on pencil trim. Pencil trim on west end knocked off when second counter top installed. Electric cook top not hooked up. Kitchen floor left with mortar residue all over it.
Storm Door When they were bringing in the countertops they opened my storm door too wide and tore out the closing ram and of course they failed to point that out to me while they were here. They did not show up as scheduled. They were supposed to be there first thing on a Monday morning but didn't show up until mid-afternoon then worked until 9 or 10 that night. I was charged $325 for the plumber to install three sets of faucets and the garbage disposal. This did not include the cost for the water lines and PVC fittings that he had to go buy because they threw the other ones away. I paid him $100.00 separate for the shut off valves, water lines, pipes and their installation. Installed hall bathroom counter top incorrectly When I complained about misaligned the hall bathroom counter top at first they said that that was the only way it could be installed because my cabinets were misaligned. When I argued the point and they scheduled Jeremy to come out later that day - he didn't show up and didn't call until 7:00 that night to say they couldn't make it and would be down the first thing in the morning. Again no show. Finally, on the third try both Jeremy and Ginger came out in the evening. After seeing all the problems, they agreed to send their installers back out. In order to help I ground the 2x4 frame down to reduce the frame overhang and then they were able to install the granite skirt so that it had a 3/16 inch lip. While it's not exactly the one and one half I wanted it is far better than the first time. This group of installers was very helpful and wanted to be sure I was satisfied when they were done. It was the best they wanted to do. Overhangs: My small bathroom overhang is ¾ of an inch not the 1 and a half I wanted. The kitchen overhang is one and one half of an inch which is what looks best. The hall bathroom overhang is 3/16 of an inch, again not what I would have liked to have had. There are two reasons I think the hall bathroom counter top skirt didn't work. First The frame they built to install it on was too wide at one end by 3/8th of an inch and overhung the cabinets at the north end. This caused the frame to be installed at an angle and by the time they installed the skirt on top of the frame the skirt was flush with the edge of the counter top. When they installed the side skirt in order for it to square up with the front skirt they had couldn't snug it up to the wall and left a 5/16 gap between the skirt and the wall.
Hall Bathroom Hall bathroom 3/16" Better overhang ¾ inch(small bath) Overhang in kitchen - 1 & ½ inches - looks good Hall Bathroom The frame was made from wood that was badly splintered at one end. The wood frame was wide and the plumber couldn't install the sink faucets because of the wide nuts that had to be used to hold the faucets firms to the cabinet. I had to take a special grinder I have for wood working and ground that area down in order for him to be able to secure the faucets to the counter top, but first I had to remove 6 or 8 small finishing nails some one has driven into the wood for what reason I don't know. The wood frame was badly splintered at one end and you could peel large strips off however they insisted the 2x4 was new and solid. It sure doesn't look like it to me. Second It appears that they might have cut the granite counter top too narrow by about 1 inch. Which they are adamant they didn't do. They told me the problem was because of the cabinet base. Well since they are in the business and they should have known this and should have taken the proper measurements to adjust for any issue. Also since they put a ¾ in granite skirt under the counter top they should have made those adjustments for both bathrooms as well. When measuring for the counter top they didn't use a template and didn't take into consideration the extra width needed. As a home inspector I see a lot of theses granite counter tops installed and since all this has happened I have been measuring bathroom granite counter tops in the homes I have inspected and all ten of them have had an overhang of one and a half inches.
The hall bathroom fixture is too close to the back splash and it's hard to operate. I was told by the plumber that this was because of the large sink lip. Again adjustments should have been made. One and a half inch clearance Sample of a newer home - three and a half inch clearance They tried to fix the bathroom counter top so that I would have the overhang I wanted and while it's not much better it still doesn't have the one and a half inch overhang I wanted. Kitchen - Original Installation They damaged my kitchen wall when they installed the counter top. After they had finished and left I was cleaning the kitchen countertop when I noticed it had a crack in it. I sent them an email and they replied "It often happens, especially around the sink area due to natural fissures that can open up during transport and fabrication. Once it's installed and glued down and secured in place it will never come apart. You have a lifetime warranty that would cover full repair or full replacement if needed." Also where the crack dead ends into the sink the granite is not polished and is rough and on the outside under the lip where the crack ends is a large amount of bondo where they didn't finish or polish the under side of the overhang. I still had a crack in my expensive countertop that shows up and will eventually yellow and stand out even more and I am not interested in a "repair". If this happens often as they said, then why haven't they put the necessary procedures in place to prevent it? This counter top was not cheap by any means. The installer came back out and told me he could not fully polish the inside of the sink cutout because he might damage to sink. When he left the kitchen was a mess again from his grinding or polishing the underneath of the counter top. I had water and residue all over my new appliances. Not a major deal just irritating If the crack can be fixed so that you not only don't see the crack but the repair as well then that would work for me. They came back and smoothed out the crack ridge. The first thing they did was to put a shim under the west end of the cabinet to support the counter top. This should have been done when it was fist installed. After he did his repairs I can still see the crack. As normal when they left the kitchen was a mess. When they ground down the crack the grinder sprayed wet grindings on the ice box and cabinet across the room. The sink and counter was left dirty as well and they could not smooth out the edge for the sink because the sink was installed too close to the edge of the granite and they might damage the sink. So I still have a small rough spot around the edge.
After they left I noticed the grout between the counter top and the tile backsplash has cracked and pulled away from the countertop. It was this way in both bathrooms also. Also in the hall bathroom where the pencil trim meets the side pencil trim it is a bad job of cutting and its jagged - looks amateurish. In the small bathroom it looks sloppy. This was pointed out however nothing was ever done about it. Fixtures / Plumbing: Two of the three sink fixtures were new Delta Faucets and had been previously installed. The Crew who removed the sink fixtures took the stainless steal flex water lines. I didn't know that until the plumber had to go and buy new ones which I had to give him money to pay for. They should have asked if I wanted them or not - This is my first rodeo and I don't know the procedures. We couldn't find the plumbing traps and piping - the plumber couldn't find them and had to leave and buy new ones again I had to give him the money to pay for. The plumber didn't have a car so I had to loan him mine in order for him to be able to go and get the things he needed. After everything was installed we found pieces of the pipes that could have been used instead of having to buy new ones. They left my new expensive Delta faucet that I was going to re-use from one bathroom lying in the driveway damaged and the lift rod was bent. Fortunately the damage was light and the plumber repaired it...at least they didn't haul them off with the sink. There was a total lack of communication as to what was going on and what to expect, between the granite crew who removed and installed the countertops & sinks and myself. No Water All Night - First Installation The first night the installers left the house without water all night because when my house was built three shut off valves were not installed under the sinks - I had to spend the night away. The plumber had been scheduled but his previous job overran and he couldn't make it. Had he been able to make it I could have gone to Lowes which is only two miles away and purchased the shut off valves while he was doing what ever he needed to do. I had previously purchased shut off valves just for this but they were the wrong ones. The plumber arrived late the next day and stayed until 10 pm. Plumber left a leak under the small bathroom sink. This is a small thing however I really don't want the plumber to have to drive all the way out here just to tighten a nut so I did it myself. The first time they scheduled two days to complete installation and it took three and a half days. And I rearranged my inspections in order to accompany their schedule. The second time they were here one day but the tile people didn't show so I had to reschedule a second day (Lost one inspection - $395.00).
Then I had to take a third day off work so they could complete the installation Unscheduled loss of a day's revenue on my part as those inspections I had to give away to another company. The counter bottom edge is rough in the hall bathroom and there is a rough spot in the kitchen as well. Also this granite had more white in it which gave it more of a grey appearance and I had specifically ordered one with a lot of yellow and black. I was adamant about it. After they installed the counter top they told me that the color looks different depending on what type of light bulbs I was using. Sounds logical however when they installed the new counter tops they are exactly the color I had ordered. They are a heavy yellow and are not grayish like the first one. Same light bulbs being used. This is just another instance of a quick bogus response by them to a concern that of mine. I had talked to Ginger and Jeremy about having them repair a broken drawer guide while the counter top was off and they agreed to do it however the installers did not repair it. Ginger is real nice and has a good personality and seems to want to work with you but either she doesn't understand I wanted and fully paid for, (an expensive look in my kitchen and two bathrooms) or I don't understand that I have to live with however it comes out cracks and all. Also I can understand not wanting to have to install a new counter top because it will be expensive but I am perplexed as to why they want me to accept sub-standard work when I did not pay a sub standard price. 7-12 Jeremy & Ginger came by to look at the counter top and agreed it needed to be replaced as well as one chipped piece of trim in the hall bathroom and the underside of the counter tops needed to be smoothed and the backsplash enhanced. They said it would take four weeks before they could make the changes. They agreed to fix the crack mortar between the counter top and the back splash tiles and they noticed the sink stopper where the plumber installed the old mechanism instead of the new one. After they left I tried the sink drain control in the hall bathroom and it would not close as designed. You have to push down on the stopper instead of using the handle provided. The faucet control is too close too the back splash. Also the stopper is not attached to the lift rod in the small bathroom. The bottom edge of the counter top in the hall bathroom is still rough even though they tried too smooth it out. Kitchen Counter Top Replacement 7-30 I had to take another ½ day off for them to be able to come out. 2:45 arrived.
They replaced both kitchen counter tops which I thought was unusual since only the one needed replacing however they said they wanted both sides to match however I couldn't tell the difference. They damaged the back of my new sink with their torch as they were loosening the bondo that holds the granite to the cabinet. The soundproofing or insulation came off in an area about the size of both of your hands put together. According to Ruvati this voids my warranty should I ever need it. Two back splash tiles came off and need to be replaced. One pencil trim came loose and they shortened one pencil trim which will now need to be replaced. Ginger and I talked about modifying the counter top by making it four inches longer. She had suggested this for the first one but I didn't do it however since they were going to have to replace the counter top I ask her to do it and told her I would pay for it. She told me she would do it at no cost. The counter top was not lengthened the four inches Ginger agreed on. The installer quickly stated they couldn't do it because the piece of granite they had to use to cut the counter top was too short.??? With all the wholesalers here in the area they couldn't find a piece the right length? Also I wondered that again with all the wholesalers in the area why they bought the first pieces of granite from Oklahoma City. When I called Ginger about the length she also said they couldn't find a piece long enough. The installer told me that one problem would have been if I had of added the four inches then I would have had to extend the back splash which wouldn't look good - Wrong! You would not extend the back splash as it would make the counter look lop sided. It was just an attempt to make me feel they were looking out for me and doing the right thing instead of admitting their mistake. If they were not able to find a piece of granite long enough why didn't Ginger notify me to find out if it was ok or not? I could have waited to get what I wanted. Also Ginger told me she would give me enough pencils to frame my bathroom mirror with (about 14) but that didn't happen. I had offered to pay for the pencil trim. She told me they cost $6.25 each and I agreed to pay. However, they didn't bring them when they came to replace to counter top. But now I have found them for $4.65 a piece. Any time you bring up an issue they quickly have a smooth explanation to cover it. (Monkey Muffins)
Second Installation The mortar around all where the granite tops meet the back splash has cracked and Ginger told me they would repair this issue. Not only did they not do it they left the kitchen counter top not sealed to the back splash. The tile people couldn't make it and they would be here as soon as they had the time. They did not enhance the back splash tile as they agreed to do. While the kitchen counter top was off I was able to repair my broken drawer guide myself. Ginger told me that she had had to fire the plumber. He had wrecked his truck and was having trouble getting to the jobs and that apparently she was getting several complaints about his work. The new plumbing company called and told me they couldn't make it out today so now I have to take another day off so they can come out and connect my kitchen plumbing and hopefully repair the drain controls in both bathrooms. Another night and day with no water in the kitchen. I called Ginger and she told me to hold on as she was on another phone line. I could hear her talking and after about four minutes I heard her hang up. After another five minutes she never answered me and I could hear her talking to people in the office so since she wasn't concerned about my call I hung up. 8-1 Another ½ day off waiting on the plumber. We will see what happens. The Plumbers came a little before 1 pm. They took about 30 to 40 minutes and did a great job unlike the first one who took over 3 hours and left everything a mess. They couldn't hook up the electric cook top which I understand. But no electrician came to hook it up so I will have to get an electrician to do it myself.
8*3 While I was sealing and putting a finish on my small bathroom back splash I noticed one cracked tile and one tile with the corner missing. They had a whole box of tile left over why didn't they just replace both tiles at the time they were installing them? 8-2 I sent Jeremy an email outlining the results of the last visit by his installers and the problems I still have. 8-5 I still have not received a reply from Jeremy or anyone. They are so busy they don't have the time to takes to stay on top of their customer service so they send someone else out then if it doesn't work it appears as if the client is one of those whose always has a compliant about little things. When they need to come back out you have to wait until they can find the time to fit you in and it's always been in the afternoon and they work into the evening which is a major inconvenience on my part. Once the job is finished they depend on their installers to take a few pictures and tell them it was ok. No one comes out to check on the finished product. They have no quality control except for when a customer complains. 8/5 / 7:45 pm Ginger sent the following email "Charles I am sorry we have been very busy, my plan was to send the tile guys back out as soon as they are open to bring the pencils and do the grouting that needs to be fixed. Also I could not retrieve a slab that was big enough to get the extra 4 inches. I called and the only one they had that was longer had a big ugly vein in it. I will let you know an opening as soon as the tile guys are available. I have to get this shower finished by Thursday deadline. This is over a month after my final payment to them. 8-6 Since I have already paid them they said they will come back when they are not busy. Another day of work lost. Enough is enough I emailed them and canceled any further dealings. I have decided to either do it myself or have someone else do it. And I told them so. Their replay was "ok if that's what you want to do. We tried". I mean "We tried."? Really?
8/11/14 Ginger called about my BBB review. Told me that my repairs were a small job and that they just couldn't pull people off bigger jobs to come out and they planned on doing my repairs when they had a break. I wonder how she would have felt if I told her I needed to pay a larger bill off first before I paid her the final payment. That I had other deadlines to meet and as soon as those were met I would send her the money. She told me that they normally did not replace cracked counter tops and that they didn't have to send a plumber out the second time to fix what the first plumber screwed up and that they did all this as a favor to me and they don't re-attach cook tops. She said it is common for people to not have shut off valves. If this is true, why doesn't the plumber carry shut off valves? Very angry lady. I had to hang up on her. When they put in the first counter top they took the large piece of granite they cut out of the counter top for my cook top. Granite I had paid for. I called and told her I wanted that piece because I was going to use it for my night stand top and ask her how much it would cost me to have them to cut the edges. She told me that if I wanted it to look like the kitchen with the two inch edge it would cost $261.00 but if I just wanted it cut and polished she would do it for free. I chose the cut and polish. Ginger's response to my review with the Better Business Bureau was that the kitchen was beautiful and that I was just mad because she didn't bring the few pieces of pencil trim to me. I have spent close to $6,000 on this project and I don't think I am going to be upset over $70.00 worth of trim I can buy at Lowe's. The kitchen does look beautiful from a distance. However, when you get close you see all the mistakes and it's doesn't look as beautiful. My problem is not the cost or the pencils but with all the issues and problems I have had to confront over the past two months. I have found out that once you pay them the final amount anything left unfinished or problem will have to wait as they have other projects that come first. One other thing, Ginger told me she would get me my sink at her cost. Well I noticed on her bill the sink was listed at full price. I know this because I researched this model and knew the retail price. Honestly I don't mind as she had to order it and every thing and should make something for doing it; however, it's just another example of not doing what they said they were going to do. 8/15/14 Electrician came out this afternoon to hook up the cook top. $97.00 Angies List. Had I looked up the reviews on Angies list and the complaints presented to the better business Bureau I would not have used this company had I done this first. Here are the reviews from Angies list I copied. They have five reviews four of them (One being mine) have an "F" rating and one has an "A" rating. Even the "A" rating had a problem with them showing up late and working late. Here also is the one review I could retrieve from the BBB
Angies List Member Comments: In April 2013, I signed a contract with them for installation of granite and sinks. My wife had a get-together and someone at the party said Jeremy said he would do a great job. It was a friend and so I wrote a check. I never saw from him again. I got an attorney. My wife went down there and asked for the money back and he said if I go down there, he would put me in the ICU, just like an another person. Anyone thinking about using this man needs to check the criminal records in Tulsa and see that he is a felon. He has served time and has several hot checks. I am at the bottom of the list, so I have yet to receive any money back because so many people have sued him. I lost about $15,000. He is well known at the Tulsa court house. Is he the type of man you would want to hire? I don't think so. He is a smooth talker and nothing he told me was the truth. He has ruined my life. Member Comments: They took my money and ran with it. I signed a contract on 4/2/13. It was supposed to be installed on 4/15/13. I wrote a check on 4/5/13 for $12,169.00 that was cashed on 4/8/13. Since that time I can't get them to return a phone call or do any of the work. He completely ignored the letters from my lawyer. We went to the granite company to check and he has not even paid one penny on any of the supplies. And our granite was there, available and waiting. My wife went there to talk to them and they said that we can go ahead and sue them and we won't get any money. He then told her to send me to the office and he'll put me in ICU just like he did another man. In my opinion, there are a number of very qualified businesses in the Tulsa area that install granite. You are taking a bad chance if you select Victory Stoneworks based on our experience. Share on Band of Neighbors: Yes Member Comments: We selected Jeremy Victory based on positive feedback on Angies List (4 reviews). We live in Blanchard and Jeremy is in Tulsa but he said that was not a problem. Jeremy is a former member of the Air Force and a super nice guy that was easy to get along with. When he arrived the day of the install, he brought a couple of helpers to assist him. They started at 1 P.M. and did not finish until 5:30 the following morning! I was leaving town and needed to get the plumbing completed so I had no choice but to allow them to do this which ultimately ended up being a mistake. Most of the granite still needed fabricating so a makeshift granite shop was set up on my driveway. The cut out for the stove was done in the house causing the entire house to be covered in granite dust! It was a disaster the following day. Early in the install, Jeremy realized he didn't have shims for the drywall for the backsplashes so I volunteered to make a trip to the hardware store to get what he needed. By the end of the installation, everyone was exhausted included my entire family that was up all night also! I think this exhaustion contributed to some of the issues that were discovered the next day. The next morning, I noticed that a couple of end pieces in the guest bathroom were not anchored nor buffed. I contacted Jeremy and he provided two pieces but they were from another slab so they didn't match at all. I ended up taking the original pieces to a local granite shop and had them buffed and installed them myself.
Most disappointing was the fact that some of my granite was sprayed with a type of clear coat versus buffing so I am REALLY not pleased with that. During the demolition, the countertop in one of the bathrooms was lifted out yet they had not disconnected the plumbing so the drain broke by the wall leaving no room to repair later (I ended up having a plumber come out to finish the plumbing). Bondo was used as an adhesive to mount the sinks in the bathrooms and it was placed right where I needed to install the faucets so I had to get a hand grinder and make a huge mess to remove this stuff so I would have room for the faucet connections. Additionally, no sealant was used anywhere, so I again had to do this myself later. Bottom line, you'll save some money with Victory Stoneworks, but you'll get what you pay for so if you use them make sure you keep a close eye on the installation and do a thorough walk through when it is complete. Member Comments: The first appoint was cancelled because according to him I did not answer the email fast enough. I had an appointment set up with this company and he had to rescheduled for another other customer. I have tried to contact him multiple times but he has not gotten back to me. I have had to miss work to make these appointments only for him to cancel and not show. Better Business Bureau 4 complaints closed with BBB in last 3 years 3 closed in last 12 months Complaint Type Total Closed Complaints Problems with Product / Service 4 Advertising / Sales Issues 0 Billing / Collection Issues 0 Delivery Issues 0 Guarantee / Warranty Issues 0 Total Closed Complaints 4 - See more at: http://www.bbb.org/tulsa/business-reviews/construction-and-remodeling-services/victory-stoneworks-intulsa-ok-38026148/complaints#sthash.xsqttb3m.dpuf Complaint Category: Failure to honor a contract or agreement Complaint: Contractor required money for materials and half of labor. Failed to honor terms of contract and complete the job. We entered into contract in May 2013. Mr. Victory told us various stories as to why the job was not completed... including placing blame on ************* Stone. I called the stone warehouse to inquire about the order. They said that he never placed the order. After confronting Mr. Victory, he assured us that he would honor his contract and complete the job in a timely manner. He now refuses to return any messages. Initial Business Response This complaint is a result of misunderstandings and we always have every intention to resolve this and finish the job. The customer called the wrong supplier for information. Also the supplier they should have called had to get the correct color made and shipped. It took longer than expected to get the correct material. The customer did not have the correct phone numbers for our business and therefore could not reach us regarding there job. We have contacted the customer and the job is being completed and we are very sorry that they had a bad experience. But in our defense it was a mistake on our suppliers behalf and a lack of communication due to customers not having the correct contact information. - See more at: http://www.bbb.org/tulsa/business-reviews/construction-and-remodeling-services/victory-stoneworks-intulsa-ok-38026148/complaints#sthash.xsqttb3m.dpuf